How current is Slick?

[elias4444]

I suppose these questions are more for Kevin... but anyone else who might know, please feel free to answer. 

I was just wondering how current the Slick engine is? I'm actually looking for a solid 2D engine for my next game, and am seriously considering Slick. Is it still being actively developed for? It's hard to tell because I can't find a version anywhere for it.

I thought about going with the JMonkeyEngine, but they're more geared for 3D stuff, and they're having issues keeping the code up to date with lwjgl 2.0 (I know, just check out jME2 from the svn repository... but I've done that, and setting it up is a real pain compared to Slick).

Also, is there anyway I can help contribute to it? I saw that you're using some of my old code for things like truetype font rendering. I've actually updated and optimized that quite a bit (although I'm personally moving over to bitmaps for my font generation now). I also thought it might help if I contributed my OBJ loader to the project. I wouldn't mind just throwing this stuff into a zip file for someone to plug into the engine (or maybe I could do it myself after learning the engine better).

Please let me know. 

[kevglass]

Slick is still actively developed, the build number is posted on the website, current version #236. I don't generally believe in arbitrary version numbers - though cause I was pressed there was a 0.2 release not long ago.

However it's worth noting that Slick really isn't a 2D engine (in the same way that JME is a 3D engine). It's a bunch of utility stuff that makes things easier. It doesn't manage anything for you really. There have been some things built on top (SlickSet for one). I've never found a 2D game system to be open enough to build into a generic engine.

The Slick forums are active, we now have a few regulars who are happy to help. I'm currently working on a 3D game using JME and Slick for the UI so my focus is shifted a bit at the moment, I'm mostly in bug fixing mode atm.

Contributions, yep someone else actually contributed a TrueType font system based on your original code (hope we got the credit right). Contributions are always welcome but I do tend to plaster everything in documentation, so if you don't want my bad english applied to your code then it'll need to be documented before hand

On the other hand...

JME does work really well as a 2D engine (there's that Turborilla game for starters) and it is super powerful in so many ways. It's also very efficient in it's state sorting (especially compared to Slick which really doesn't do much).

If my opinion counts for anything I'd say if you want to do some retro/conventional style 2D game then Slick is a great fit. If you want to use the techniques mostly applied to 3D in the 2D world to create something sexy then JME is probably a better fit.

Apologies for the long post, hope it helps.

Kev

[elias4444]

Apologies for the long post, hope it helps.

Nope, that was perfect! I think I keep leaning towards Slick just because it's NOT a full-on engine. I've been tweaking my own engine for so long now, it's hard to let go of that sort of control. 

But yes, it's probably time for me to invest myself into learning jME. I've tried numerous times, but keep deciding it's easier to just code it all myself than to try and figure out someone else's technique. Only problem with that tactic though is that you end up building an engine more than a game. 

I've decided this time that I'm going to build a game (as opposed to an upgraded engine), so it sounds like jME is going to be what I use. If it's good enough for Kevin, it's gotta be good enough for all us, right? 

Thanks again!

[Grandmaster B]

Hi,

i have a similar opinion as you elias. I've been a C/C++ 3D engine developer and i personally have other expectations from a engine as others delivers it. I like small and smart engines that are more like a supporting toolkit than a big black box to throw objects into. For the lack of those i decided to implement my own small engine. I don't really reinvent, i only implement features i need and when i need them and it don't need to be very polished or documented.

I've also tried lot engines (for c++) and there are few that integrate well into a my pipeline, most just burdens you with poor documentation and extensive features which you feel like you should implement instead of concentrating of important tasks.

However, as you said, developing a engine and a game the same time is difficult. Having a engine that works for you is the greatest thing a developer can have regardless where it came from.

Best regards
Bastian

[elias4444]

Just as an update to my findings here:

I LOVE SLICK!!!! 

I tried jMonkeyEngine, and yes, it's powerful, but I keep running into roadblocks with it. First it's a stray bug here or there, then I try to use their physics engine and it has bugs as well. I'd go back and use jME1 (the stable release), but it still requires lwjgl1 (meaning, no worky on newer Macs or Vista with certain drivers). It just FEELS overly complicated to use. With great power comes a more chaotic environment I guess.

Slick, on the other hand, although made for just 2D games, is amazingly simple and straightforward. Everytime I think I've run into something it can't do, it ends up just being something I haven't learned yet. And then, once I learn it, it's simple. The code from SVN just works, and compiles nicely. The physics stuff (phys2D) is equally amazing and nice (and native Java... meaning you don't have to worry about adding more natives for each platform).

Now, I'm not dissing the jME guys. They've done great work, and believe me, I know the pain involved in making a 3D engine. I also understand that jME2 is considered alpha, but jME1 is still too outdated to use for making games that run on current systems. I think jME is simply in a time of transition. When I decide to go back to making true 3D games (something I swore off after my last one), I'll definitely be considering jME again.

In the meantime though, great work on SLICK!!! PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE keep on developing that toolset/engine.     

And of course, another big THANK YOU to everyone involved in the LWJGL project! Without you, neither of these engines would even exist!